What People Are Commenting
Our Lady of Bethlehem,
Dancing Carmelites & ‘Pope Siri’
The Next Article on Bethlehem?
Greetings and thank you for your excellent site.
I am eagerly awaiting next part of Our Lady of Bethlehem. I don't mean to rush you, but merely to encourage and enquire when it may be published.
Dr. Horvat responds:
Thank you for your kind words about the article. I hope the fourth and final article will be ready to post this Friday.
It is a most beautiful statue, and I was surprised to learn about it. Today, unfortunately, she is hidden away behind glass in a side room, when she should have the place of honor in all California!
Marian T. Horvat
What are we to think of the so called contemplative Carmelites, performing a tribal "township" dance? Outrage at the corruption of the beautiful traditional Carmelite rule!
Surprise that women, whom we suppose must be intelligent, would think that such a display would be pleasing to Almighty God and Our Lady. Is this really how Brides of Christ should behave? My consolation is this: The vast majority of those women are middle aged or older.
Their convent is quite obviously not receiving new vocations. It is clear now that young ladies, who have a vocation, are entering the more conservative, traditional religious orders. We should not be surprised at this. The vast majority of young ladies and young men called to religious life wish to be challenged. They want a life of sacrifice and piety.
The liberalism and feminism of those orders, which lost their way after the errors of Vatican II, are simply not appealing. Thank God for this.
As for the dancing "nuns" of course, we must pray for them in a spirit of Catholic charity. Pray that they will re-discover the glory, the self discipline, the piety and the sheer beauty of the traditional Carmelite way of life. These "nuns" have replaced a jewel with a piece of very cheap costume jewelry.
Giving Stones instead of Bread...
Fr. Conway of Joliet's not-so Catholic Diocese: what a teacher! [Read this link]
He is in line with the teaching of Vatican II and very much in communion with the Church, as some would say (not this someone of course).
Will SSPX have to go this route also?
To the Point
Just a short note to say that the views expressed on the last Bird's Eye View were correct and to the point.
God bless you,
Cardinal Siri Rejects ‘Pope Siri’
Thank you for all your marvelous articles. I am in your debt for many positive changes in my life, especially my baptism which you confirmed as invalid, (it was Protestant ) therefore giving me the assurance that I needed the "laver of salvation."
I have a challenge for you and I hope you are academically honest enough and humble enough to address it.
In a recent response to a sede-vacantist you said you couldn't hold to their idea because it was like "a body without a living head."
I understand this parallel, but I don't think it is really fair to the sede-vacantists. That statement makes them look too simplistic. Mostly they either think Cardinal Siri was elected pope at the death of Pius XII but then was forced into seclusion by a series of impostor popes, or they hold to other less likely men as their popes. They don't usually say there is no Peter at all.
Please be fair to the sede-vacantists. You have many friends and allies among them and I'm sure they benefit from your site as well.
With kindest regards,
Dear Mr. D.L.,
Thank you for your amiable words about our work. We are proud to have assisted in your conversion to the Catholic Church.
You seem to be making a small confusion between the sede-vacantists and the followers of others “popes.” The latter are not sede-vacantists in the proper sense of the word, since they already have their “pope” and consider the Church to be visibly governed by someone. Those who admit a pope cannot in fact be truly sede-vacantists; it is a contradiction in terms. By calling themselves sede-vacantists, they implicitly admit that their pope is false.
Top left, Card. Siri in normal attendance at a Bishops' synod under Paul VI; bottom right, in cordial conversation with John Paul II
Notwithstanding such incoherence, this imprecision of language is adopted by many. We will refer to this position by putting the word “sede-vacantist” between quotes so that we can answer you without imprecision and show you that we are “academically honest enough and humble enough” to address this issue.
You seem to think that claiming Cardinal Giuseppe Siri was elected pope does not make the “sede-vacantist” look simplistic. We do not agree with you.
The claim that the real Pope elected in the conclaves of 1958 and 1963 was Cardinal Siri is so out of reality that it was not even supported by Cardinal Siri himself. The following can be read today on this topic on Wikipedia:
“Although claimed by one sedevacantist group that Siri had actually been elected to the papacy in 1958 and 1963, only to be displaced by Angelo Roncalli (Pope John XXIII) and then Giovanni Battista Montini (Pope Paul VI), Siri entirely submitted to the authority of the official popes and remained in full communion with the Church, refusing to support any sedevacantist organization.
“One small sedevacantist group centered in Houston, Texas, still claims him to have been the actual pope, despite Siri's own silence as to this claim. This small group, known as "Sirianists", have yet to offer any reasonable explanation for the fact that Siri failed to support the sedevacantist movement, that he recognized John XXIII, Paul VI, John Paul I and John Paul II as legitimate popes, that despite his conservatism he celebrated the Mass according to the reformed 1970 Roman Missal and the other revised sacraments, and that he signed all of the documents of the Second Vatican Council. The Cardinal even somewhat defended the Council, as long as it was interpreted in the light of Tradition.”
This ensemble of fact seems to us a quite conclusive evidence that leaves no room for the empty pretensions of these few “sede-vacantists.”
So, your request that we should address the Card. Siri issue is attended. The conclusion is that these “sede-vacantists” affirm the see of Peter is empty for more than 50 years. Therefore, our previous comments apply to them also.
TIA correspondence desk
Posted October 11, 2011
The opinions expressed in this section - What People Are Commenting -
do not necessarily express those of TIA
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